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Putin's Russia And Related Discussions.

Discussion in 'World News & Debate' started by enrico.swagolo, Nov 9, 2016.

  1. mapdesigner

    mapdesigner Member

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    is it true that putin have not assasinated all his oposition candidates (that can contest his presidency?)
     
  2. Nezekan

    Nezekan Moderator Staff Member

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    No. They are just unlucky and always stumble upon poisoned food :cat:
     
  3. mapdesigner

    mapdesigner Member

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    thats exactly what I heard LOL
     
  4. Rubz

    Rubz Member

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    I live in South Africa so I think I 'm more justified in making such statements.
     
    mapdesigner likes this.
  5. NaL-Ra

    NaL-Ra Member

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    You can live anywhere you want, you shouldn't use that example and that term, when portraying something negative/bad.

    it's distasteful.

    It's like me braking both your legs and then laughing and judging your performance at running a 100 meter race...
     
    Last edited: May 10, 2017
    Nazeekan likes this.
  6. Rubz

    Rubz Member

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    I speak from my experiences,if you can't understand that then why should I hold anything you say to regard.

    You can't blame all of Africa's problems on the past. Sometimes you have to admit you're fucking up stuff now too and its not someone else's fault. Things that you could do correctly yourself.
     
    ManOnTheCan likes this.
  7. NaL-Ra

    NaL-Ra Member

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    Leader of the free World, Vladimir Vladimirovich Putin, will comes to aid yet another country being torn apart, for the interests of USA's establishment, Shadow World Government. Unlike Syria, which was/is being torn by military force and needed military help, Venezuela is being torn apart by artificially created economy crisis, and is in desperate need of humanitarian aid, to ease of major civil unrest and provide basic human needs to its citizens.

    Russia's Putin pledges to send food to Venezuela
    Putin to Send Enough Wheat to Venezuela to Stop Food War
    Russia to Send Wheat to Alleviate Venezuela's Food Crisis
     
    Last edited: May 19, 2017
  8. NaL-Ra

    NaL-Ra Member

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  9. mapdesigner

    mapdesigner Member

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    Hello,

    I am wondering. They say he killed his opposition and all. I am wondering what makes him worse than other goverments. There has been lot of killing in last century.

    I am talking about US and all the wars it launched in the middle east, as well as Vietnam and killings all over the world. why does the world seem to watch in silence?

    I am just thinking that politics has been as dirty and cruel as it has ever been. Not sure if clean politics exist, but there might be in few EU countries (Sweden and such) and there is nothing special about putin, except that since he is against US, its propaganda is gunna be against him lol

    Thanks
    Map Designer
     
  10. ManOnTheCan

    ManOnTheCan Member

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    He's a bit of a dictator but the main problem is his geopolitical interests are fairly opposed to the US.

    For example: alliance with Iran, annexation of Crimea, soft control over former Soviet countries.
     
  11. mapdesigner

    mapdesigner Member

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    but why would anybody in this forum not stand at equal distance from both poles? why would anybody like US government over putin?

    I see putin might have done bad things. BUT I see US government as a whole might have done equally if not worse crimes all over the world. Yes I cant point out to exact president, but the countries policy never seemed to have changed at all... since as far as I can remember lol (and prolly few decades before too)
     
  12. HHHNNNGGG

    HHHNNNGGG Member

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    Both sides are shit, but sometimes we have to choose the lesser evil.

    Frankly, why would you even blame the US in Vietnam War? Even a kid knows that Vietnam War is a proxy war between Soviet bloc and the US.

    Off-topic, but until when people actually realize that China is the real shithole and neither is Russia or US?
     
  13. r0xo

    r0xo Member

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    That is probably a good place to start.

    I think the problems with him are how he has curbed some freedoms, there isn't a 100% freedom of speech (as far as I know) and things like the treatment of homosexuals. Certain bands not being allowed into the country, yes it is a small thing but its a lack of freedom of the population. Certain images etc criticizing him not being allowed.

    Then some things around how he got into power. I can't remember that too well but there are some nice documentaries about him on youtube. Personally this isn't the worst thing to me. Then the unproven but pretty much certain corruption that he allows between government and private enterprises. Sure this happens in other countries but the extent to which he allows and facilitates it is pretty crazy.

    Now the reason why people have a bigger problem with him than some other leaders: Yes the fact that he is the Russian president definitely plays a role. But I think it is about his indescretions bothering people more than the ones committed by for example the US. For me personally that is why I think he is a worse person. Objectively killing thousands of mostly innocent people is worse than denying some freedoms but in my view I would rather live somewhere where a government commits those things than somewhere where I am not allowed to do certain things.

    He is a genius politician though, he is incredible at what he does and while I think he is a bad guy I can't help but also like him at the same time.

    I think a proxy war is even worse. It has this feeling of "we want this war but we obviously don't want it on home soil, so fuck this other poor little country". But the US and USSR are equally to blame I think. It is just the way the US approaches war that pisses me off. I always thought the Vietnam war was all good and noble with how badly people were seen who didn't want to fight. But then I found out what it was about and I couldn't believe that anyone would act that way. Just because you don't want to go fight in a silly war in a situation where your country isn't under any threat you are a pariah.
     
  14. hwchu

    hwchu New Member

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    not really about Putin, but rather about the public's awarness about political entities's action in general. If we look back at history and see examples like the U.S actions in Guatemala, Russia in Crimea, and now China in the south Pacific and Taiwan. Or go way back and look what happen to the Natives of America, the Jews, African slaves etc etc. Countries have always been exploiting the weak to gain more wealth and power through out history.

    Just that now we have the U.N. and lots of news media so you get a lot of fingers pointed at you if you do something questionable like trying to develop nuclear weapons or annexing territory like North Korea, Russia, Israel etc.
     
  15. kamukag3e

    kamukag3e Member

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    Hello, let me plant my thoughts here with you.

    1) He doesn't actually literally murder competitors, he just discredit them by all means lawful or not.
    He as most leaders of former soviet countries rise in both power and money before becoming the face of Russia and then use those money and connection to get into the seat of ultimate power - where he has all the laws in his one hand, while handling the business, oligarchy and all the shady sectors with his other.

    2) He is charming, intelligent and strong willed. So he is easily likable by his country-man or at worst respected because of that. The same from his opponents. He should be also merciless otherwise he wouldn't get that far in his life - that's how things roll in the ex-communist countries.

    3) He is not a dictator. He just wields too much power in comparison to other countries leaders, because he has good connection with the head business companies or is the owner himself via proxies. For example in the US or Europe the big corporation still have a lot of power and change some of the laws so they favor them just by the sheer pressure then can cause for the economy.
    In Russia you have to give some to get some, so they are not in position of power, but more like someone wanting something from rival with better position.
    True dictator usually get all the power, V.P. held a lot of it, but not the whole.

    4) Media and international interests is what gives a lot of negative image of him, while his own propaganda machine makes him the knight in the shining armor defending his country and country-man interests.
    He represent Russia and having overall selfish (in therms taking actions benefiting Russia) interests, he usually disturb other's country goals, because Russia is still a super-power, even when not the leading one. It's still one of the G8 (I mean, in therms of influence, not in the group right now).
    So his decisions while selfish are still benefiting Russia and it's economical allies in different spheres.

    Let me put that from different perspective - every one is looking for themselves. If you look some conflict - both parties have some goals and some wrong-doing. Goal might not be noble, but just greed - greed is not bad. Every developed country have done something very bad in the past from pure greed, then they get the benefit and grow in power. Now while we're ahead and judge someone doing the same - labeling it 'bad'. Well, give all of the income of your country to the one being 'bad' few years in a row, and then try to get out of the crisis without doing something 'bad' to someone else.

    Even WW1 and 2 were because of money, power and zones of influence, not because of some personal ambition. The Holocaust was for example a non-pleasant side event which unfortunately got a lot of casualties, but still was far away from the reason.

    Right now while WW is out of the picture, because of Atomic weapon treat, big and strong countries are doing everything to keep their position and gain further lead without causing too much 'political' stress while doing awful things.

    Putin is as good in this as others, or perhaps even better, so they hate him cuz they ain't him.
     
    mapdesigner and Eli_Green like this.
  16. HHHNNNGGG

    HHHNNNGGG Member

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    Well yeah, Vietnam War or Korean War, both are proxy wars under the cloth of civil wars.

    The issue with the US was that everything they did was pointless. Kind of like, "let's screw this country up half-dead and leave it there, ah don't mind about the dollars and soldiers we wasted". They could have resolved a problem but no, it is better to deal with politics first.
     
  17. Eutychius

    Eutychius Moderator Staff Member

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    Merged thread with the other Putin/Russia one.
     
  18. enrico.swagolo

    enrico.swagolo Member

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    Putin is not a genius politician, and he is not charming or intelligent. He isn't even doing anything that hasn't been done by other Russian tsars/dictators in the past. He is literally doing the thing that has worked before because the Russians are generally passive and apolitical.

    But also, y'all can't read Russian and don't see the news, online discussions, and real life opposition taking place in Russia right now. Many people call him trash, and in the past 6 years there have been continuous protests against him and his government. The Western media doesn't write about it, and state-sponsored media like the Russia Today channel always feed the general populace same old propaganda. That's why the opposition has been successful with independent blogging and videos on YouTube, since the hosting hasn't been banned yet, and the government just can't control what people upload. However, they have jailed some bloggers and even people who vocally opposed annexation of Crimea on social media. Tell me again how Putin is a charming genius, when he is literally gulag'ing people like they did back in the day.

    Western media has a certain fetish for Putin, and in a weird way it's rooted in russophobia. So at the end of the day, you are presented with distorted fetishization from the Western media and propaganda from Russian state media, but not the truth.
     
  19. kamukag3e

    kamukag3e Member

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    @enrico.swagolo:
    He has his PR team who makes him look good (visually and as a head of Russia in the eyes of the common, passive and apolitical people).
    He is charming and intelligent, perhaps you do not know what stupid people look like when they enter the politics.

    I know a lot of people in and out of Russia are against him even the biggest saint would have enemies and opposition - I do not like any politic and especially Putin. I don't read only western media, nor only Russian.
    It's normal for people in power who have connection to the shady side of the business to be ruthless and I already stated so - he will always clear of his way anyone who is threatening his interests. Jailing bloggers means he at least uses legal means (even if you can consider it 'set up' case in the court of law) - in some countries (while considered developed) people just disappear and it's public secret they are actually killed because of their believes or actions.

    First - while the action in the past (and today) were expansive in nature they were far less impactful in therms of global politics, so to be able to do so today requires a lot more finesse and understanding.
    I didn't say this is good or bad. I don't like selfishness in people or in government but I don't judge it - it's human nature.

    I didn't say in a single place that Putin is a good guy. Just stating why he is liked or at least respected by some people both in and out of Russia.

    And you sound like heavily biased Russian guy who hate Putin - this is your right, but just spewing bad things about him doesn't make him less accomplished man. It's the same for the current US president - Trump.
    He might be *put offensive slogans which are used for him daily*, but that doesn't mean he is not a millionaire and the president of the most powerful country in the world right now. I could never achieve any of those two. Putin is the same - billionaire and leader of one of the most powerful country. If you think it's easy to achieve ... it's your problem.
     
  20. lovestep

    lovestep Member

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    You know that he's gonna reply to that by saying it's white privilege that helped them both, right?
     
    ManOnTheCan likes this.