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Notail, does he really deserve his current spot

Discussion in 'Competitive' started by justsightseeing, Sep 21, 2017.

  1. justsightseeing

    justsightseeing Member

    Jan 31, 2010
    Ok, i not really avid viewer of dota comp scene, but i do follow them.. mostly in VOD from youtube tho i do watch some live matches if it align with my schedule..

    ok, make things short, i have seen growing hate on the guy, esp after TI. his last TI performance was good IMO, its just the draft doesnt really favor him..

    (spoiler alert)

    i've seen their play in last qualifier and they sadly lost. and i feel notail get the most hate from it.. i agree that his performance in the last series was lackluster, especially how reso looks carrying him hard, but does he really that bad? is he really a tier 2 carry player that doesnt deserve to play in OG?

    whats your opinion, is the hate on notail was deserverd?
  2. dewouter

    dewouter Moderator Staff Member

    Oct 27, 2009
    There is a reason why he won most majors. He just plays different then other players on a similar so when it doesn't work out it's obvious to point out his weaker stat.
  3. Z01d

    Z01d Member

    Feb 26, 2014
    Fun fact: Carries in comp have become less and less relevant.
    The game has become centered around mid with farming mids since TI5 or even earlier.
    The safelane only matter in push lineups.
  4. kamukag3e

    kamukag3e Member

    Jun 11, 2009
    I've played a couple of games with him, not impressed by his play, game understanding or personality.
    He is not a bad person or players per se, just nothing out of the ordinary 6-7k player.
  5. justsightseeing

    justsightseeing Member

    Jan 31, 2010
    i agree that pos 1 position is kinda blurry and interchangeable between mid and carry safelane. even so, he still need to do farm and be safe.. his last game was not impressive at all..

    do you think he's fine in OG or OG actually deserve better safelaner?
  6. r0xo

    r0xo Member

    Dec 9, 2012
    I am a massive fan of him but I will admit that play wise alone he is not the best carry, might not even be a top tier one?

    But this is very important and what makes me say that he does deserve his spot and does not deserve the hate:
    As a teammate he brings so much to the table, enough that for OG at least he is a top tier carry. In a world of robots you would say they should get someone else but with them being people I think he is the best for them. Also remember that he does bring a lot in terms of decision making etc

    And yeah the fact that he plays quite differently gives him hate. It is always that way, if someone experiments with a new hero or weird build and it doesn't work people tend to say that is the reason for the loss. He is a very selfless carry, he gets involved a lot early on and you can see that he plays more of a 2 role and enables the mid. And I think it is good enough. I think it is probably just because of how he has played all his life. From the old hon days (back when mids weren't super farmy) when he was a massive play maker and then when he played 4 for all those years. And its not like he can't farm.

    But I do think he is improving with time, he was already quite a lot better than OG's first year. Also take into account that he is playing with 4 guys who are amazingly good at their roles.
  7. RisaStoleMyHart

    RisaStoleMyHart Moderator Staff Member

    Mar 26, 2014
    As a long time fan of Notail since his HoN days, i think he's alright. Maybe he's not a great carry because that's his role in the team, also for the reason Z01D mentions, the safe carry is not as relevant anymore in early/mid game (hence, duo mids and 1 extra creep). When Era was replaced by Excalibur, Fnatic played a different type of 4-protect-1 which worked great for a short time. When Miracle was on OG, he was clearly the one who received space and farm priority.

    I think Notail's playstyle is similar to Matu and MP. Both Notail and MP gets criticized, while Matu is successful because of his team.

    I want to see Notail go back to support.
  8. justsightseeing

    justsightseeing Member

    Jan 31, 2010
    i mostly agree with you about role.. he is kind of sacrificial carry where he give space/farm for other pos.. glad to see people here doesnt actually hate him, but man.. sometimes people like to criticize so much about him. While, in my opinion he doesnt really held back his team.. their enemy simply better at the game while their winning strat (illusion hero splitpush) is already nerfed.

    anyway patch is getting stale.. hope for new patch for new fresh start for those who play in high level dota.
  9. Kris

    Kris Moderator Staff Member

    Jun 15, 2009
    I generally dislike him as a player. I think his play is particularly, loose, risky, and non-standard. There are some games it applies pressure other teams aren't used to dealing with and it works out. There are other times he just does completely stupid looking things that are game losing.

    He's generally been surrounded by excellent supports which let him get away with some of the clowny plays, but if his supports don't get decent hero matchups I've generally found his play unimpressive.

    E: Apparently this is quite an old thread despite being halfway down the page :/
  10. justsightseeing

    justsightseeing Member

    Jan 31, 2010
    heh, every day is slow day in playdota...

    OG get the spot in mdl but that without secret in the quals...