1. Hello and welcome to the brand new home for PlayDota!
    Please read through our Welcome thread to see what's new!
    Dismiss Notice

New Rank Calibration

Discussion in 'Dota Chat' started by KinGe, Jun 8, 2018.

  1. KinGe

    KinGe Member

    763
    27
    28
    Sep 23, 2009
    I recently started playing this game again for the seasonal rank.
    I won my first game and apparently the pudge on my team had 5.7k before calibration. After post-game, my team asked him his new mmr and he got boosted to 6.4k. According to him, he won 7 games and lost 3.

    Now what the hell does this mean?
    Even a sub 5k player from the previous season can now get up to 6k if you happen to win more games than you lose during the calibration phase.

    Conversely, this can mean someone who goes like 2 wins and 8 losses may even be placed lower than previously before.

    Fret not, dota 2 players - your epeen in this game does not measure your success in real life (probably).
     
  2. kamukag3e

    kamukag3e Member

    3,824
    453
    83
    Jun 11, 2009
    @KinGe:
    I think that the re-calibration system works with some higher rating values but using as base your previous rating.

    So basically no one can move more than 1,000 rating from his previous, but to achieve that he must over/under-perform in every single game of those 10 and not make a single under-performance - because that could easily negate huge chunk of the gained additional rating.

    For example if you can get from -100 to +100 rating per game, you can gain anything between them and a single -100 game can easily wipe 2 +50 games etc.

    Also - I don't think win/loss actually matters that much. In all the calibration games so far - personal performance was put more value then the outcome of the game.

    P.S.:
    Higher rating in DotA is more likely to put negative results in real life then lower rating, unless becoming a professional.
     
  3. MrFrank

    MrFrank Member

    3,644
    3,078
    113
    Oct 8, 2016
    I think it's the reverse for re-calibration this time around:

     
    F. E. A. R. and kamukag3e like this.
  4. kamukag3e

    kamukag3e Member

    3,824
    453
    83
    Jun 11, 2009
    @MrFrank:
    Is there some confirmation that Jeff is Valve staff member ?
     
  5. MrFrank

    MrFrank Member

    3,644
    3,078
    113
    Oct 8, 2016
    If you go to the Reddit thread he is flaired as such, I'm pretty sure only Valve employees are given the Valve flair.

    EDIT:
    Wait there was a whole thread for it:

    Also comments on the re-calibration on Reddit seem to be that your MMR already was, + whatever if you won more games or - if you lost more than you won. Apparently.
     
    Last edited: Jun 8, 2018
    kamukag3e likes this.
  6. ManOnTheCan

    ManOnTheCan Member

    4,527
    454
    83
    Aug 18, 2013
    Good, forcing random stuff like damage or kill ratio is stupid.

    What matters is how many games you win and how good the players are you beat.
     
    kamukag3e likes this.
  7. kamukag3e

    kamukag3e Member

    3,824
    453
    83
    Jun 11, 2009
    Agree, plenty of ways to abuse a system which you know how to exploit.
    And was really punishing different techniques.

    I was playing multiple games WK as support in the past, and was always considered as "core" by dotabuff, because of the high stats I was managing to acquire. But that was not right, when I was basically roaming the first 15 minutes and having access to no farm at all to compare me with players which were supported by their teams and having completely free-farm for 15 minutes at the end.

    Also think that #4 was severely screwed every single time in calibration, because he is not 'supporting' as much as the dedicated support and receiving less additional rating for 'support', but he is also not performing on par with carries to get rating for that.
     
  8. MrFrank

    MrFrank Member

    3,644
    3,078
    113
    Oct 8, 2016
    Yeah but I don't wanna end back up in the wasteland that is Legend where bad teammates drag me down, I wanna stay up here in Ancient where I truly belong!
     
  9. Leadblast

    Leadblast Member

    5,024
    62
    48
    May 31, 2010
    Both of them had advantages and disadvantages. I prefered the old system even though it could cause misleading stats such as amount of wards bought and others
     
  10. vorsybl

    vorsybl Member

    1,183
    41
    48
    Mar 17, 2015
    I won 9/10 calibration games, and gained +800 mmr, from 1400 to 2250. This morning I woke up, and it says 1600, I'm also still in shadow pool and expect to lose at least 500 mmr before I get "normal." That's a real thing, I learned a day after getting banned here. And I only learned about it 3 weeks ago, after playing since 2012. In 2017 I got LP once a week, sometimes twice a week, and according to the video, shadow pool has been around since 2014, which would explain my horrible experience with allies in 1k mmr this whole time.

    It takes ~ 20-40 games of playing without getting reported to normalize your behavior score, I know because I put the time in, then shortly thereafter my internet dced, and I caught an abandon, undoing that week of "work." I also lost 80% of those matches being matched with the same individuals most of the time, who I can't win with.

    And how did i not get reported losing 89 percent of my matches? Staying silent, the whole time, watching my allies throw, play wrong, do stupid things, etc. I had to stay silent the entire week, losing my mmr, for the same obvious reasons. It's funny, the system definitely works, since those people behave the same way, only they're different every game. Same behavior, different people = shadow pool.

    I'll be able to quit once behavior score is normal, and I continue to lose down to herald rank, where I probably belong. Even with all the stacking and pulling, denying offlaners exp, hitting all my spells, itemizing properly, etc etc, still can't win with these particular individuals who, are in shadow pool most likely from the way they play and accruing reports. I've now skipped out on 4 job opportunities to play this shit, and regret it now.

    I'm making this post for anyone who is experiencing these things, to give them an explanation, since the people who manage the game don't tell you this thing exists, you have to lose all your time first, before learning about it:

    Same throwing allies every 2-3 games in a row
    10-30 minute wait times for match, even with hundreds of thousands of players online

    When I had normal behavior score for, what was it, 8 hours before the internet dced, my wait times were 1-2 minutes, and my allies didn't throw, which confirmed its existence.

    That's "shadow pool," valve's hidden moderation system for toxic behavior.
     
    Last edited: Jun 9, 2018
  11. Leadblast

    Leadblast Member

    5,024
    62
    48
    May 31, 2010
    So if I was 50% away from Guardian 1 (lol) now I am 65% after 1 win that means 1 win equals to 15% towards next medal?

    Edit: 2nd win took me from 65% to 80%

    I lost one and went back to 65% then won another one with a rather subpar performance but got up to 82%. I think there was a Guardian 1 or something in the enemy team, which may explain the additional 2% increase but I'm not quite sure about that

    Only 2 more wins to get back to Guardian tiers.... oh well at least there's no "Guardian 0" this time rofl
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Jun 9, 2018
  12. vorsybl

    vorsybl Member

    1,183
    41
    48
    Mar 17, 2015
    All those numbers don't really mean anything to me anymore, it's all bullshit to make you think you're getting better, that you have control over your outcomes.. The people behind the game will find a way to keep your winrate @ 50% and not let you "improve."

    In DOTA 2, each match will always be inconsistent. I cannot say the same for "normal" behavior score, since I was there briefly, however if it's the same dynamic there, this game is a huge waste of time if you're playing to be a "winner" and/or highly ranked. In one match, the hard support will go safe lane, and support the hard carry. But in the next, the hard support will go offlane, and fool around, feed, ruining the entire game.

    Take it from someone who has been exposed to this diligently, for the last 6 months, every day, for about 10-15 hours. After learning more about how rigged matchmaking is, and being exposed to it for so long, in hindsight, it explains everything. I didn't want to believe my father when he said it was rigged, because I love the game, and I don't want to give up on it, but I'm getting pretty close. I'm actually looking forward to life without this game in it at all. This much time spent on drumming, or programming, id be pro at those things, and make some cash. I'm just accruing debt by playing DOTA, and getting depressed and doing drugs to compensate for the helplessness.

    In shadow pool, you can't say anything to your allies, because you'll get reported, perpetuating the process. It's very difficult to sit idly and silently while your time, your work, is thrown down the toilet.

    In all the games I've played, this is the most rigged, more so than Blackjack in a casino.

    This way, they keep people playing until their lives are ruined and are tapped out, how else would a "free to play" game make money? And why would they care about the players? They have to put food on the table and keep the lights on too right? They've made an addictive game even more addictive with the prospect of a big, 30 million dollar prize pool, and the cosmetics, and everything else there is.

    I feel like the only way to be sure it's an even, unrigged match of DOTA, is when you're in a party with people you know personally, whether IRL or online.

    Haha, this is so funny. I'm on 4th game I believe of shadow pool gaming, i slipped up the last 2, so i have just stay silent now as i haven't hit LP yet again. Each match, people on my "blacklist" are showing up. Haha. This is the fourth in a row that i'm seeing the same allies that throw, go afk, give up, and do stupid lanes. And I've already lost 250 mmr since this morning
     
    Last edited: Jun 9, 2018
  13. Leadblast

    Leadblast Member

    5,024
    62
    48
    May 31, 2010
    Don't do drugs duh. Getting depressed over the rank system is bad enuff

    We should do a "low MMR metagame thread" just for this purpose. Getting out of these trenches of hell lmao

    I think I'm going to switch over Phantom Cancer as my main carry to get out of here. People are catching up to my Weaver abuse
     
    Last edited: Jun 9, 2018
  14. vorsybl

    vorsybl Member

    1,183
    41
    48
    Mar 17, 2015
    You seem chill bro, i Just don't want anyone else to go through what I've went through. With respect.

    It seems like a lifetime ago where I was excited to load up a match of dota, to meet new people and friends, and have some trippy game play.

    That day is long gone.
     
  15. MrFrank

    MrFrank Member

    3,644
    3,078
    113
    Oct 8, 2016
    There it is.

    And to make it juicy only have low MMR players be able to post in there. Would love to see what advice they throw at each other.
     
  16. vorsybl

    vorsybl Member

    1,183
    41
    48
    Mar 17, 2015
    Because I hate you, and would probably put you in the hospital if I saw you in real life, and would gladly goto jail for that (would hang myself in prison), I'm going to spend another 8 hours recording the shadow pool, to prove to your disgusting face that it is rigged. I even posted a video explaining what's happening and you're going to deny it still? I've already been playing for 15 hours and the stupid conduct summary hasn't refreshed.

    I just played AM against shaman and wraith king offlane with both of the supports on the team AFK and throwing, you're going to tell me it isn't rigged ? And in the past 15 hours, I've played with the same individuals half the time? What's good man, with 600k players online, and i get the same teammates in a 15 hour session? What the hell is good my man?

    Oh look at that. Took me 15 hours, but a new conduct summary has refreshed, and im down from 7 reports, to 5, so now, I will play another 15 hours, without saying a word, and losing 500 mmr, so I can prove to EVERYONE THAT IT IS RIGGED

    1k mmr shadow pool live

    Ah yes, my friends guerillatactics, and drug bunny, both of whom I have less than 15% win rate with over 30 matches, according to "TEAMMATES" tab in dota.

    Not rigged right mr frank?
    I mean you're so pro right bro? 10 k mmr mr frank?
     
    Last edited: Jun 9, 2018
  17. Leadblast

    Leadblast Member

    5,024
    62
    48
    May 31, 2010
    I wouldn't play AM though. He takes a shit ton of time to come online...
     
  18. Lama051

    Lama051 Moderator Staff Member

    10,615
    128
    63
    Nov 13, 2009
    Everyone knows that behaviour score plays role in MM as well, or rather once you drop below certain behaviour rank. If you act like an asshole you will be thrown with other assholes as well. This kind of system is meant to show you how annoying your behaviour is to other players and is supposed to open your eyes and better up yourself. If you do not do that, well, not sure if you get to complain afterwards.

    Also I frequently play with similar people as well, it is natural, if they are in similar MMR and play at similar times you are quite likely to meet them. Try playing in super odd times and see if you meet same people again. I doubt you will.
     
  19. MrFrank

    MrFrank Member

    3,644
    3,078
    113
    Oct 8, 2016
    Ye so the alternative to not being terrible is being 10k? I play this game as a complete casual since I don't have nearly the required amount of attention span or dedication to play one game mindlessly. I must admit to being a lowly Ancient (in the previous season, haven't played the new season yet).

    I've experienced nothing like you have so it's difficult for me to empathize, yet at the same time it's known that the system punishes those who deserve it so, although I don't want to make smug judgement against other people without fully knowing their situation, I can only assume that if you are in that position you must have done something to get there.

    Also, I suggest you put the effort that you exerted in making threats to imaginary online people who have no influence on your life into something worthwhile. Peace and happiness, brother.