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2018 and no 100-tick servers?

Discussion in 'Dota Chat' started by RNGeezus, Jul 2, 2018.

  1. RNGeezus

    RNGeezus Member

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    OK so we all know that Valve is blinded by the insane amounts of money the cosmetics produce for them, but can we get some of that money invested back into our game to make it register better? It's complete and utter dog-shit reg that pisses me the fuck off more than nothing other. Is there a limitation on the game-engine that prevents 100-tick servers from ever being possible? We need more frames so that we never end up on the same frame as another player and everything is smooth as butter. Also, pathing sucks major $$$$ how hard is it to program something that takes the most efficient route? I hate when I click on something near me and I go the long way to get to it...So simple yet valve refuses to invest in their infrastructure the game runs on and appears to be using it as a cash grab.
     
    Last edited: Jul 2, 2018
  2. ManOnTheCan

    ManOnTheCan Member

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    I dunno, why don't you give it a shot if it's so easy? Then you can sell it to Valve and make a lot of money.
     
  3. Abdulink

    Abdulink Member

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    As long as Reddit keeps worshiping Valve, drop the idea of them ever caring.
     
  4. Equivocal

    Equivocal Member

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    Indirect nerf for ministuns :crybaby:
     
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  5. RNGeezus

    RNGeezus Member

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    I guarantee I could, but they won't hire me because I'm 24, yet I could code circles around them.

    They said Valve is a place for professionals to jerk each other off while they reap $$$ from cosmetics and sit on their ass and for me to apply again after I've suffered more of the corporate rat race. Fuck these guys

    Half life 3, need I say more? Not even in development yet.

    You can literally use bots to populate the game stats if you really wanted. Valve doesn't even require you to change emails for each account. Wouldn't surprise me if valve has put their own money in the game to give the illusion it's doing fine, when it's actually dying.
     
    Last edited: Jul 2, 2018
  6. Nisamraw

    Nisamraw Member

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    To be honest, while it would be 'better', if Valve has to work, it rather be on something that has higher priority on the to-do list. For instance, reworking that horrendous matchmaking or ban system.

    Playing on better servers is meaningless if you're playing with the same pool of toxic players, griefing with total impunity.
     
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  7. ManOnTheCan

    ManOnTheCan Member

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    Sounds like you're jealous, and over-estimate your abilities while under-performing.
     
  8. RNGeezus

    RNGeezus Member

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    Nah, I just know lazy developers when I see them. Just trying to call them out on their terrible infrastructure and point out how someone could artificially inseminate their steam statistics based on a loophole / their lazyness in the system.

    Source: I'm a lazy developer
     
    Last edited: Jul 2, 2018
  9. Vixori

    Vixori Member

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    Why do you want 100-tick servers for a dead game?
     
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  10. MrFrank

    MrFrank Member

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    I could literally do everything in existence by doing everything in existence.

    Source:
    I could literally do everything in existence by doing everything in existence.
     
  11. kamukag3e

    kamukag3e Member

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    @RNGeezus:
    I know quite good, near genius developers which are around your age.
    They won't say such high words for themselves, because they understand how little they know about an close-source game.
    And while they are aware in the things in their field - they won't be able to get in the chair with access to the code and BAM be ready.

    Even if they could work on this project, they would require quite a big amount of time to understand the alien code and then re-work it without issues.

    And you stating 'I'm lazy developer and I could do circles around them', that's what usually a code monkey could say.
    Basically the typical Dunning-Kruger.

    I'm not saying you are stupid or don't understand the field - but you indeed sound like that.

    On topic:
    If you can do it for free - contact Valve, state your abilities, sign non-disclosure contract (free of charge on your side) and gain access to the code, re-work it and then just pay the few thousand dollars for new servers and it will happen.

    I'm rather sure Valve won't invest in such thing which is only trivial improvement worth quite a lot with little to no benefit for the company.

    A lot of young people with no idea of how important management is follow the crazy logic - if I can do it I will do it.
    You have to have a much better reason behind that, not thinking about the investment, nor the requirements but just for a fraction of the result is easy way to bankruptcy.
    There is a therm called 'over-engineering', over-funding a certain field is also bad move when you have quite a lot of branches to take care of.

    While DotA is a big thing for Valve, it's not their most treasured product, investing in new servers exclusively for DotA is bad and that's easily seen from a layman like me.
     
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  12. RNGeezus

    RNGeezus Member

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    Right, because there's always more to learn. At some point you have to become confident of your abilities, which a lot of computer science kids lack because they seem to always put themselves down
    and lack confidence, Its a huge turnoff for women too..

    Thing that you may consider hard, may come easy to me. I've always been able to figure out what it is I need to do. Obviously you would need to get your environmental factors in place, nobody is improving Google the first day on their job.

    I'm only 'lazy' because there's no need for me to be fully functional when I can receive the same pay as someone else that does a LOT of work. I'd rather do the bare minimum and conserve my brainpower for investing in my other avenues that I actually care about.

    I've already become aware of the fact that I don't know a lot since age 10 and have always gone deeper and deeper. I've made strides to improve myself. I will say that I do know more about computers and their systems than most people and have been successful at anything I have applied myself in.

    Oh believe me, I get it fairly well. You want to get a job that asks the minimum of you but has a high payout. You want to get out of the rat race ASAP and become financially independent outside of your day-to-day job because no matter how hard you work yourself, 'getting to the top' is only an illusion that you tell yourself and most company's could care less about you and only care about what you can do for them. You are a pawn in their game. Get treated like a pawn and I'll act like one and use it to my benefit, which is nice because I'm still a 'young and stupid engineer' and I'll be creating other avenues of income while you're killing yourself with support tickets.


    Right because cosmetics and battle passes fill enough money in their pockets to fill their their payroll and create a profit.

    Considering people are using DOTA as a test-grounds for artificial intelligence, they might want to look into future-proofing a game that's only going to grow. Imagine when you have super-intelligent AI that can actually utilize the different timing windows. It would be quite a shame if they always ended up on the same frame, right? This doesn't happen much to humans because there's a lot more of a delay to process the information and it rarely happens.

    I'm fairly certain that Valve does have the resources to do this and it wouldn't even cost them much if it was done correctly. You act as if some DOTA servers are going to cost them tens of millions of dollars, it can be done cheaply, but Valve is a big name and people see them with dollar signs in their eyes.

    So if a 20 million dollar tournament game isn't your biggest priority, then what is? It sure as hell should be, or that management team needs to be fired ASAP.

    Because while you consider it dead, it will be used for research purposes. There's more uses for a game than just entertainment. It's probably dead for you, but not necessarily everyone else.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Jul 3, 2018
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  13. kamukag3e

    kamukag3e Member

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    @RNGeezus:
    I'm far away from being knowledgeable in the field of software development, I just know few guys which are considered some of the best in my country and some guys who are considered very talented in all the companies they had worked in.
    So can't speak about how they feel or know - I only can state what I have observed.

    Thus I'm not pointing fingers at you, just stating that you sound like a person with high opinion on his skill-set (it may be covered by your abilities but I can't know that) while all of them act quite humble until the moment they get how a said thing works and after that they can say how easy it is to work with it etc.
    As an example I can put a case where DotA2 can be more easily written from ground up than being fixed in some areas - plenty of times with very big and old code it's the case as far as I'm aware of.
    So saying stuff like that (which you state) can be very different when you have access to the gibberish which is there.

    Completely agree about the lazy part, but still in consideration of the things I mention about the smart guys I know - all of them can be considered workaholics, not all of their interest are put into their job - but they are never lazy, even using their work-time to increase their personal proficiency of something related etc.
    Well, that's the thing - cosmetics are very little work for big profit. Much more valuable in therms of resource investment in comparison to better servers.

    I think that DotA is still far inferior then SC2 and Blizzard already provided much better environment for AI research in their game (but I'm not as informed on that matter as someone else, so I might be wrong).

    Valve have the resources - sure, would it cost as much - not so sure, but they have servers and pay the maintenance all over the world. They also use a lot of their servers to host other games, basically they already have the place and staff - so that's not going to increase the cost, but they can re-use the servers depending on the traffic, while additional brand new servers will be only useful for DotA.
    It might not be bad per se, but tell me - what will be the profit out of it (outside of slightly better experience for the players) with even a dollar invested into research and purchasing additional machines.


    Steam my friend, Steam is their cake.
    DotA is perhaps the cherry on the top.
    But they can do pretty much fine without it, of course no one would kill the gold egg laying hen. But why would you build a mansion around it, when an ordinary house would do just fine.

    They already get a lot of money from DotA, additional improvements are not needed until it will fix some problem - they don't have problem.

    IMO DotA will eventually lose the importance after few years and they would have to build some other game or invest their money in other services, so every dollar spend on DotA which does not give considerable money back is a wasted dollar.
     
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  14. RNGeezus

    RNGeezus Member

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    Well said.
     
  15. kamukag3e

    kamukag3e Member

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    @RNGeezus:
    That "well said" is the sad reason we won't see a lot of improvements.

    I'm all about better servers, changed match-making algorithm (which a lot of people advocate for, while being really immature for their demands) and others.
    I just don't believe it will happen because of how unimportant that is to the revenue of a game compared to the invested money.

    Look at it as any business instead of 'my loved game'. Will some change improve the income generated by it and how much it will cost to do it - in simple words - if it won't generate at least twice the money invest in a span of an year - it's not worth considering.

    Better servers surely won't, because the ones we have right now are perfectly fine (pieces of junk) which all the other games have, so while upgrading them would be really good experience for the players will not make people shift to it, nor pay more.
    Same with other stuff, it would be cool to have them, but without them we will still play DotA (and occasionally pay in it).

    P.S.:
    Plenty of people misunderstood what I usually state in the forum to 'defend Valve' or being a 'valve-knight', while I just state the truth - how the corporate world works.

    Glad that you didn't do that.
     
  16. ManOnTheCan

    ManOnTheCan Member

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    There's a reason OpenAI is working on Dota 2. 5v5 is much more challenging than 1v1.

     
  17. Mimic

    Mimic Member

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    There are much bigger issues to worry about for this game. Valve has yet to invest in any political correct or sexuality. For example, there are not many gay heroes in the game or mentally retarded hero. Not PC enough. How can you expect 100 ticks when we cannot even get a true gay hero?
     
  18. ManOnTheCan

    ManOnTheCan Member

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    Storm and pango are gay I think. Legion commander is probably lesbian.

    Ogre magi is mentally retarded.
     
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  19. kamukag3e

    kamukag3e Member

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    @Mimic:
    What about the furry community ?
     
  20. slipkwar

    slipkwar Member

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    Storm and Techies are enough
    Pango :p